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well Joe I cannot think of a better way to start 2024 than to be here talking to you and already this is shaping up to be a really really big year for you so what does it feel like to be coming into your first Main Event um I would say a lot of excitement upon you know the announcement and actually come to fruition me actually getting a main event spot in my fourth fight um you know I guess a number 10 guy at that you know a pretty high ranked guy it’s not like I’m just just breaking into the cups of the rankings and and trying to test myself I’m fighting somebody in the top 10 something I’ll take pride in after I take that uh that spot from him so uh I would say initially a lot of excitement and just another day for me though you know more work um a bigger commitment to the goal and uh trying to see how far I could really push myself past what I already have so um trying to figure out who I am does it feel like you thought it would because I mean this is something that whether they would admit it or not every every new UFC fighter thinks about okay what the first time I made a ven a fight I mean I’m sure you’ve pictured it is it is it shaping up the way that you imagined it would so far I honestly haven’t put that much thought into how it would feel um it doesn’t feel different for me you know I’m treating it like another fight um it is the biggest fight I always put that pressure and anxiety on myself um because it is you know the next the next step forward is always the the most important goal and uh you know that’s what keeps you on the trajectory to keep going so um I wouldn’t say it feels any different for me I don’t feel pressure I don’t feel any different um I got a tough guy in front of me and that’s what I’m preparing for and it’s a fight it doesn’t matter somebody’s number they put next to his name or the highlights they put together of past people he beat that weren’t me I don’t care for any of that I care about you know the best Jack Hermanson that’s going to be in front of me and uh how I’m supposed to take him out you said it a second out you know you’re three and0 in the UFC and a lot of people I think on the surface would see that right you know you’re 3 and0 in the UFC already in a main event spot you’re kind of making this look easy but it has been anything but easy for you um is the truth of it and so I guess take me back to August 11th 2020 right you get your opportunity to have this huge fight in front of Dana White and you suffered this horrific arm injury what what was going through your mind in that moment I never felt like uh I had wasted my life before you know um and I was living out of my coach’s house uh he was my wrestling coach from high school and like I said I never felt like I had ever wasted my life doing something for so long and in that moment I felt it because the immediate tweet was oh you know Piper dislocated his elbow he’s fine that came from Dana White um and his tweet and everybody being like Oh at least you got millions of views on on that and oh at least you’re famous for this and nobody understanding that as you know I don’t get to shake the boss’s hand I don’t get to you know plead my case for a rematch or when I come back or that’s it you know you just kind of get escorted out and that’s it uh opportunity gone opportunity lost um regardless of the circumstances you know it it wasn’t Dustin’s fault uh I did get Matt returned right my arm dislocated and broke it’s just when they when you’re going away in the ambulance and and the doors are closing and you realize you know now I’m 27 years old I’ve been in the sport for 23 years uh at the time you know 2020 it’s quite a bit of ways uh you know back um I think it was 189 years I’ve been in the game and then here I am with no money sitting in the in the back porch with my my coach with no money no idea how I’m coming back being told that I’ll never be able to fight again with this kind of injury and uh yeah that is kind of over so uh it was a very dark place a very uh haunting place and uh a place I hope to never go back to so uh it was very hard when did you realize I guess at what point did you know that it wasn’t you know this easy six week type of recovery because I think a lot of people we become desensitized to stuff like that in this game a lot right like oh we got injured he’s just going to go away for a bit come right back and it it almost becomes no big deal so when did you realize cuz you had a of complications happen when did you realize that this was not going to be you know a a straight line road to recovery for you I personally believed it wasn’t going to be easy just because of the trajectory in my life um so I kind of had that gut instinct before I was told um you know it was more than a dislocation which was a radial head explosion pretty much um and it’s one of the worst things that you can have because of Mobility because of um it being in the joint itself so uh I knew B basically after they put me out in Las Vegas and they reset it and they kind of had an x-ray of it that there was a ton of bone pieces in there and uh they it was so bad that they had to wait for the swelling to come down so they could try to get in there otherwise they wouldn’t it would have been inoperable um and much harder and you know you have a ton of nerves in there and um a lot of things that you have to be careful with on those surgeries so um I knew it almost immediately and uh and if I didn’t know in a few hours I knew a couple hours later so I knew within a day that this was this was probably going to be the toughest test of my life as to far as as far as my commitment to this game and how bad I really wanted to do it and uh weren’t hurdles I was willing to jump over to stay so at that point I mean did you was there a point where you thought I may not be able to fight again yeah um immediately after they told me you know um it could slip out again it could break um the chances are like a 70 30 as far as the nerve damage as far as being able to punch and it not dislocate or get slammed on it and it pop out again um it freaked me out and I had complications after the first six months of that first surgery and then I had to go back you know I was complaining to the doctor that originally did the surgery I was like man something don’t feel right I’m telling you like I just joined this gym I was working with Coach John Marquez punching and I felt like it was just stuck and then my shoulder overcompensated like crazy because my arm was still bent and uh you know I really started setting in like oh I might not be able to do this and uh it scared me you know it scared me a lot and uh you know I had a lot of mental demons to get past and I was resilient and went and got a second opinion a third opinion and then I found my doctor uh tosy um who you know was like look like we could do the surgery it’s it’s like a 30% chance it’s going to work and 70% it’s not and you might that might be it for you as an athlete and I don’t know if he calls the conversation but immediately I didn’t even hesitate I was like let’s go let’s try it you know if this is everything I did in my life for then let’s do it so um yeah I did it and uh you know I’m still not 100% as far as it being a perfect arm but it’s good enough and I can I can scrape by and do my thing and I still got punching power so that’s all that matters 30% was enough for you to say let’s do it scheduled it right there second it came out of his mouth 5 seconds later I was like let’s do it and we we we scheduled the surgery second surgery you strike me as someone who you know MMA is not just something that you do it’s a very it’s a big part of who you are and it’s a big part of how you’ve overcome a lot of things in your life so to be sitting there and even considering the possibility that that could be taken away had to be really a dark place for you yeah uh it was a suicidal place for me it was a depressing place for me you know um not having the support system then that I do now I still had a great coach who basically saved my life and is the only reason I’m in the UFC is because of him you know having somebody like him who always believed in me no matter what decision I was going to make he always said that nothing nothing was impossible for me because anything I set my heart and my mind to I could achieve right you know the cliche statements but I think that man really believed it and I I couldn’t and wouldn’t uh exist um moving forward if I hadn’t taken that chance you know I owed it to him I owed it to the to myself first and foremost that you know even if I got in the UFC and I lost and I got that second chance and I didn’t make it I took the chance you know um many of times like that man provided housing for me for a few years where I didn’t have to pay rent you know and he really wanted to see me make this dream I mean so uh I owed a lot of people I felt on my heart to go and still believe and still try and you know I knew I had a lot of pieces missing to the puzzle still I was training three days a week hit pads with my former coach um and I had a friend at the time uh that only had wrestling had no MMA experience and I would trade with him three days a week and I Would Do My Own Strength conditioning and I made it to the contender series off of that and I was knocking everybody out off of that so you know now when I had my arm break I knew I had to make a change before I my arm broke and I made that change still and then when I came back I had a foundation coach John Marquez and you know Jonathan web my Jiu-Jitsu coach and and just a whole Foundation Sean Brady teammates that lived this life you know for a long time I was the only one that lived this life so um the arm Break made me change and gave me the time to change everything I needed to to uh really make this run possible was there a specific moment or conversation or something that happened that allowed you to to finally see the light at the end of the tunnel in that situation um I would say after the first surgery I didn’t really see the light I was in tons of pain doing the the the you know the physical therapy the rehabilitation process and then when I got the second surgery basically all that was for nothing and you had to start back at square one and uh but Dr tossi the way that he presented it to me made me super hopeful um and I would say the light at the end of the tunnel came soon as I came out of the operating room and I remember remember being all Dopey and like cut trying to wake up but I remember him hearing he had a great success that’s all I remember hearing it was like kind of dark and like obviously I I didn’t have my vision yet but I do remember the words that you had a great success he’s going to be good I think he’s going to be better than he was we got full extension and you you just have to make sure he’s got to do his PT and blah blah blah and I just remember that so I don’t really have a vision but I do remember hearing it and uh that’s all I needed to hear I just needed to hear something uh in a positive light from somebody who did the surgery so you get the positive news and it was just a decision essentially that you made that I’m not going to allow this hole to suck me in any further and from now on we’re we’re moving forward yeah no I mean I I I I I could still punch now this is what people don’t understand so my arm is still not 100% it is stuck I cannot force it to go anymore every time I punch my shoulder overcompensates I’ve had injuries to my shoulder this is why I was frustrated the last fight I’ve had injuries to my shoulder I’ve had broken hands I’ve had ever since my arm broke I’ve had the worst injuries I broke my ankle on my comeback fight two weeks after when I made my comeback fight I broke my left thumb in half still fought the fight still knocked the guy out I have had nothing but hiccups I have not had a smooth campuses I’ve been in the UFC so people don’t understand who I am at 100% health I’m doing this interview and I was sick all through Christmas and I have lost my voice right so I I know how strong I am because I’ve never been given a smooth clean slate and I’m sure there’s a lot of Fighters I preach it to the choir it’s never going to go 100% smooth but I’ve always had something kind of big jump in the way to try and knock me down and I think that’s just the trajectory of my life I’m supposed to live and uh I’m okay with it because I know I can I can Triumph I know when you put my back against the wall you make me the underdog you tell me I’m not supposed to win I’m going to try and defy that defy that odd every time and uh almost take joy in being being doubted because I was never believed to be here and be in front of you you know people don’t understand or be in front of Dana that I’ve been watching this since I was before six years old you know seven years old and uh here I am and that’s all belief you were built to overcome absolutely and you did that in 2022 when you came back to the contender series and we got the phrase that we all know and love B Joe Piper uh when when Dana white said that what was your immediate reaction did you think it was a big deal at the time that he said that no I didn’t I didn’t I I was I I felt almost tickled like huh that’s funny like that’s that’s literally how I felt that’s kind of how I still feel because um I don’t think I had a spectacular performance I I remember telling you that my legs I was so nervous and my legs like were gone I I almost had the shakes like I was sick like I was like something’s wrong but I was so nervous because I put all my eggs one basket and um I had no plan B I’ve never had a plan B for my my life and if that didn’t work out I don’t know if I’d be here you know and that’s not a sympathy thing it’s just I didn’t see myself being anything else I don’t see myself working a 9 to-5 and I’m a very passionate emotional person and I I go at something with everything I have um so when I heard that it was you know for the first time in my life I was I was a representation of something for my not just my career career and my my fight but my my name yeah you know I’m the fifth Piper and um every one of them have uh been ban to their kids so uh and I’m the first athlete to you know really go all in on himself so this is it and um yeah I don’t think I had a spectacular performance but I showed that raw motion I showed that I was pissed off at Dana and cursing and no not trying to be disrespectful but I’m a passionate being and I don’t care whose toes I step on in that moment you know that was that was changing that was life-changing I was about to be homeless so uh yeah it’s pretty cool to look back on that phrase because you know you and I have talked about this before but just to hear him say you know be Joe Piper not just in the moment in terms of like be Joe Piper as a fighter be Joe Piper when you’re on the contender series but to hear him say be Joe Piper and have that kind of live in the ethos how much did that night that phrase that fight all of that how much did that change your life beyond whatever thought my life could be you know I I never I always plan for the walkouts for the fights for the you know the things I might say when I win you know but it always comes from the heart I always it up and it never it’s never something I say from a script it’s always something I say from a feeling and that’s why I chose this I didn’t want to be filtered I didn’t want to be a fake character I don’t have to sell a character I’m intriguing enough I got a presence about me that if I’m in a room you know I’m there and uh if you’re fighting me you know who you know you’re fighting somebody that’s going to bring it to you so um I think the whole be Joo Piper thing is being resilient you know not accepting what what the tabloids are saying or the social media gurus that are talking about you know statistics and striking and wrestling and what’s his Gap what’s his weakness you know I was projected I think it was a pick them in that fight but it wasn’t it wasn’t even close it wasn’t even close I got something these people don’t have and uh you know everybody says that but I believe it and if I’m going to lose I want to be knocked out or I want to be submitted I don’t want to be laid on for 15 minutes or 25 minutes that’s not how I fight it’s all or nothing so I think BJ Piper is come out there and bring it show them who you are show them that that aggression if there was no ref in there I kill that person so that’s that’s how I treat this and uh you I’m afraid to lose so I bring everything I got it was it was cool to be there for that moment it’s been really cool to see everything that’s played out and and happened to you and for you since and one of those things that happened immediately after that was I think Dana really gets behind people it gets really passionate about people that he sees are going all in on their life and their passion so and he got behind you I know he helped you out you know financially how much did that particular leg up help you at that point in your life cuz I think not everybody realizes kind of where you were outside of fighting um at that moment it’s like the highest height you just get the CFC contract but not everybody realized what was going on you know sort of behind the scenes for you yeah so I mean just to put it in context for the people that didn’t understand I I I had a a friend that I was living with that tried to commit suicide and hurt themselves while I was living there and they went to a hospital they came back that was 3 weeks out from the fight they disappeared one week from the fight so one week on a Tuesday disappeared I fought that next Tuesday you know didn’t hear from blah blah blah and you know I had to figure out where this person was I had that way on my heart was one of my best friends and you know and then we were getting basically kicked out of the house that we were living in because he neglected to tell me that his conversations with the realtor were selling the house and we had till Friday to move out so I would have fought Tuesday you know win or lose and I would have been almost or living on somebody’s couch when I say homeless having nowhere no idea where I’m gonna live by that Friday so I won the contract Tuesday obviously Dana financially helped me and secured a condo for me for the next year is what I put that towards and uh I fought Tuesday I flew home Wednesday accepted a fight for my birthday in September 17th from August 11th so I accepted that in the airport is I’m getting my bags Thursday I moved out Friday I moved in Saturday I flew out to Dallas to go watch Amanda Nunes uh Juliana pñ number two so you know I didn’t like it changed my whole life uh I don’t think I could have drummed up a better comeback I don’t think I have anything to hold my head low about you know I was obsessed with chasing that Dustin stz for’s fight back if you go back and you watch I’m screaming at dan’ll let me fight him again and I think every post fight I’ve said interview that I want to fight him again so um yeah it’s changed my life but I would love to get that one back you know with with the attention and Buzz that comes along with someone in your position especially the guys coming off Contender series who get a really big amount of hype behind them I feel like sometimes there’s this sort of backlash among the fighters where I don’t know if it’s crying favoritism or or maybe you feel like everyone starts calling you out all of a sudden because they want to take your hype away but you you’ve got that Target on your back did you experience that did you feel that at all no I mean I think Joseph Holmes that cornball called me out once and that was it that’s like the only guy I’ve ever heard call me out um I don’t see why you would call me out if you’re jealous or if you’re envious you know um I don’t care how tough any of these guys are whether they could beat me whether they couldn’t um I’ve lived a very tough life and I’ve lived a very um draining life so I I don’t care if you don’t like me I don’t I don’t know if I’m allowed to curse but I don’t care if you don’t like me I don’t care if you hope I lose I I don’t care for anybody I’m not a fanboy I’m not shocked if I see people like ah hey man like I’m In My Own Lane I do my own thing and and there’s a reason why it’s a beat Joe pyer and it’s not fight like Joe Play It’s you know I think it was said because I carry myself different um I carry myself I I go to the Beat of My Own Drum and uh I won’t be moved by anybody else’s judgments or concerns or projections of hatred and and uh you know at the same time I say that I’m very fortunate and very thankful I think 98% of my following is all positive um I I don’t get hate messages um yet but um at the same time too I’m not doing this for them you know so uh it’s why I don’t want to be an inspiration like I say I want to be a role model for the kids that are uh underprivileged like I was and um you know in circumstances with parental abuse and um just that that type of life where they don’t know where they where they’re going to go what they’re going to do so that’s my message and um let the people hate that don’t like me it’s going to bounce away I’m not going to say it talk to me about the leadup to your UFC debut because that’s probably one of the toughest things to do is to come off the contender series have a lot of people talking about you and then that debut kind of staring you down the barrel what were what were the feelings like leading up to the to your debut it was the most fun I’ve had so far yeah it was there was no pressure um you know DC it’s funny because you you hear like MMA is a repetitive cycle you hear everybody say the same you hear everybody you know I’m gonna kill this person I’m gonna beat this guy I’m gonna do this and I’m different I’m different you know but you know to each their own I think there’s I think we’re all one of one and uh we all may have similarities we all may have things that make us relatable but I am truly a oneon-one and I think I’m I think I’m different for the simple fact that I mean what I say and I don’t say it in false confidence I don’t say it to convince you I say it because it’s what I believe and I think there’s a lot of people in the sport that will say things to you to convince you but they’re not convinced themselves it’s not something they feel within and uh I feel it within and I’ve always felt it within and that’s why I’m here because I never believed I was meant to be average I never believed I was meant for that 9 to-5 job I never believed I was smart enough for school but one thing I did believe is that I had the ability to be any man that you put in front of me and sure I may have two losses on my career right one being a freak accident one I was dealing with uh some mental health issues which people that have had it understand how that can really affect um your ego going out to a fight and wanting to win even though I was dominating you know so um I think people will look at me and have question marks and that’s cool but yeah I mean uh the debut was was no pressure at all cuz I was able to just be myself and I knew I would knock that dude out I knew it like it was how do you know it’s I know I have the I know I have the power to knock out any man yeah it’s just where am I at mentally that’s always the question with me if you talk to my coaches it’s always like where’s pyer at with his mental health that’s it as long as I’m happy nobody will come close to me it’ll look so smooth my career will look so smooth and I’m talking about the top guy the champion as long as I’m happy I will dust all them if I’m not then you know I’ll make life a lot harder for myself there’s some tough guys out there and I won’t be the best forever but I could be the best for a certain amount of time I know I’ll hold that belt one day that first round knockout you looked pretty happy I was very happy but I wasn’t overly if you look at the last like the Gerald one I I always scream and freak out like that primal thing comes out in me and the duel fight you know I wasn’t as happy in those um you know with injuries and Miami was cool I did enjoy Miami but I had some stuff going on and some relationship things and just like the trajectory of trying to handle like you know what I’m worth outside of fighting you know so um I think that’s the problem that’s the danger in this right you can always be the man and we can always sit in front of you and I can give you the whole I’m the baddest guy in the world Spiel but I’m a very emotional person I have a lot of things that you know um I’m very open about because I’m a human being you know I’m not just a fighter and uh I want to be more than just a fighter so yeah I mean I was happy cuz I got 50 G’s on my birthday it’s funny to hear you talk because so you you make your UFC debut and and to be fair it’s the UFC debut that anyone would dream of you get a first round knockout 7 months later you’re on a huge pay-per-view and you get another first round knockout and 6 months after that you go and get another finish and it’s you can’t argue that it’s one of the best starts that we’ve seen in the UFC but every time I talk to you after those wins and even now there you have a much different vibe than most winners that I talked to after they win there is an edge to you at all times and I guess I wonder I wonder where that edge comes from what is that I think it’s just uh I’m not done yet I’m not done yet I got a lot to prove I haven’t beat anybody that you know like the the first guy I beat I knew I would knock him out because I think all three of his losses were by Knockouts by guys that are nowhere near my level as far as punching power um I know he had eight Knockouts right he had the power to knock me out like any man does um and I can’t get caught you know I’m a human being but um I just didn’t believe it so and I and I never thought it so um you know so and I knocked him out now you have the flip side I had nightmares of getting knocked out by Abdul and I was struggling with some real stuff where I was almost contemplating in the week of the fight pulling out and I didn’t have much of a training camp I got staffed two weeks before it and that really messed me up and then I I was sick before that and I literally it was the worst Camp IID had right so um Gerald mhart fight was great it was good I took that time so you know between the bonus and between Dana helping me with a place to live it gave me that time that I hadn’t had since I came back from the surgery cuz as soon as I got and I was cleared to go even before I was cleared to go I went back to training and then I took a fight that I got clear two weeks before to even be able to have broke my hand won that got the contender took the short notice for well not really short notice but took the fight immediately after I won the contract so I never had time to build my frame to build my body and I was doing that with no strength the editioning like I did strength the editioning but I didn’t do a Power program I didn’t try to build on my frame as a middleweek which is foolish so um winning that 50 Grand gave me the time to find be able to you know train and build on my body and do this the right way so um yeah I mean I don’t remember what the question was but no you said I mean you said the edge comes yeah you said the edge comes from he said you said because I’m not done yet and I’m curious what you mean when you say you’re not done obviously you’re not even close to being done with your UFC career you’re not done fighting you’re not done achieving things but when you say you’re not done is it is it you’re not done completely proving people wrong because the sense that I get is that you’re anxious to show people 100% of you which you feel like you really haven’t had a chance to yet yeah I don’t feel like I’ve had that Stellar performance I don’t feel like I’ve put it all together yet I don’t feel like in a performance you know I feel like Abdul I showed a little bit right I showed a a grapple which people very very very much so under underestimate which is hilarious to me so uh that’s going to be they just haven’t watched their grappling matches yeah I mean look they’re boring I just I just wrestle people and I keep them down and I stay safe you know and I I play the half court thing and uh you know I smacked Gerald even after the fight and I didn’t have to but you know everybody kept saying well if you would have gone to the ground so I was like all right cool come to Fury grappling and I smacked him there got surgery on my left arm six days later couldn’t even bend my arm still beat you so it’s just like everybody in their narratives and you know I would say the edge is just my life circumstances I’m not supposed to be here so I’m not going to be I’m not a mean person but I am not the most friendly person either you know I don’t need all the fake congratulations for people that say they’ve been following me for years and I I I specifically remember when my arm was broken everybody cast me aside and that was it like everybody lost faith in me everybody thought it was done for me you know so when I come back I have an edge to me and and it’s it’s one I I I want I want to have a beach house one day and I want to have that dream car that I want one day and I want to I want to live and know what it’s like without getting emotional I want to know what it’s like to wake up and you know know that I made it and uh so that’s what I’m fighting for I’m fighting I’m fighting for my name and to know that I made it and I can wake up and drink that cup of coffee and take a walk uh in peace and know in my heart that uh I can calm down I can I can picture you in ising like that life of not having that chip and maybe what that would feel like to not have the I don’t know that it’s pressure cuz I think you kind of enjoy it in a way you know you you put it on yourself but what what would it feel like to not have that chip on your shoulder to live your life without without that edge well I think that’s where I’m trying to achieve happiness you know I’m not the happiest person um I still struggle every day with mental health stuff and um you know money doesn’t change that um money doesn’t define happiness and I never thought I would understand that man if you have money you can have cars you could do this you know but money doesn’t change it you know it definitely helps with the anxieties of Life of you know the system that we have to live by which is money but uh it it doesn’t buy happiness and I think the uh the happiness lies and the people that you’re trusting in your your everyday life and the communication and and how you give back and I find joy in trying to help the younger generation I find joy in working on my cars I find joy in you know playing video games with my friends I find joy in a lot of things but I think it’s just sometimes I’m a very hard person on myself and uh you know I’m so tired of people that have been judging me since I was born yeah um since I was a year old because that’s when the abuse started so I’m just so I still got that that fire rage in me that it’s like when people tell me I can’t do do something watch me watch me and go ahead you know you may be able to beat me but you better watch out for that one shot cuz I I said it in the interview with you I only need one to put these people away and nobody understands to the extent what I mean by that you know I think everybody thinks I just think I got knockout power I haven’t fought the best which I have not but I’ll be able to do it against the best too so um yeah I just that takes a lot it takes it takes a toll on you you know it takes a toll on you always what’s next what’s next what’s next so you know I’m not a champion either you know it only gets worse but uh yeah I’m just trying to learn to function this is all new to me I think that you know a lot of Fighters find a lot of motivation in that feeling that you have right the proving people wrong the doubters the haters whatever it may be but now you’re in a spot in your life where maybe those things are still in the back of your mind but you’re now surrounded by people here that you get to prove right on a daily basis too so talk to me about what this gym Marquez MMA what John Marquez all of your other coaches guys like Shawn Brady what what have they meant to your journey in to get you you know here today yeah I more than they they I think it’s more than they can understand like I don’t think they I think they understand I I think I think they understand but you know like Sean not being in my corner last time me up mentally you know like he had he got sick and he couldn’t make it and he he was messed up so and then uh you know him not being there like I take so much pride in seeing these people every day and training with them and having a friendship with them you know me and Sean do a podcast together you know we talk all the time about cars and um you know uh he’s like the older brother that I never had so uh you know him being there and John’s like John’s the relatable father I never had that you know he never met his dad and I knew my dad but my dad was super abusive and didn’t care about me and you know let alone uh all the other things that came with that so um you know I’m happy to be here and know that these people care about me and it’s a safe space for me you know to be myself and I’m a tough person to be around sometimes I’m not easy to deal with you know but they deal with me well and you know uh this team has changed my life and changed the way I look at fighting and changed you know even my work ethic I’ve never had to I I remember saying when I came here it reminded me of the old school days of Fight Factory when Eddie Alvarez was making his come up and a bunch of other guys that people will know but um yeah it’s it’s a real like we’re on the fourth floor in Philadelphia and there’s no elevator there’s no elevator you’re winded coming up the stairs you know there is an elevator it’s real R they didn’t let me use it you would want to you probably be afraid to get stuck but yeah I mean it’s it’s it’s a real I don’t want to say a runchy like Vibe but it’s it’s a hardworking Vibe come here and we we go we go to work and we work harder than anybody else’s room and uh that’s often what we have found a common denominator from other people that have come from other teams or other gyms to come train or cross train and tried it and uh they’re in all like oh these guys are different these guys work like crazy so yeah I mean it’s it’s the whole key to my success from even before getting on the second Contender series so it sounds like you found a family yeah yeah it’s it’s not it’s not by Blood right it’s by choosing and uh it means a lot if you had to describe uh who Shawn Brady is to you in one sentence what would you say leader yeah yeah I’ve never met somebody that can train more let alone you know be the leader by example and the reason I would say leader isn’t because he’s not the best at saying things it’s not his for day he’s not he’s not somebody you want to sit down and be like and do a podcast yeah dry as hell Prett good I mean I watch I watched it it’s I I of I often make fun of him because he will be the driest Welterweight Champion we’ve ever had n he he’s funny he’s got he’s got his things but uh I I would say I would say it’s just leading by example it doesn’t matter if I’m sick dying whatever this man is here every single day this is his team this is his he’s the General on the team um and and let alone he’s the only person that um that I can’t beat on the ground so yeah I mean he’s he’s the leader he’s here all the time and uh you know just seeing him you know even in his comeback you know everybody wrote him off so yeah it’s something that’s something that was new for him right but we all believed in him and I think he needed to believe in himself again and you know it was State Side thankfully and you know everything went his way but yeah I would say one word is leader what would you say you have here that maybe you didn’t have before you found this family like whether it’s whether it’s technique wise and like gym Vibe wise or just you as a all that it’s all that it’s gy it’s gym Vibes it’s technique Wise It’s I don’t even say technique I I got really good boxing because of my coach Samy orpa who’s still in my life and I still he comes here and he’s I get him working out and he’ll be in my corner in February as well um but yeah I mean I would say it’s just the camaraderie and like-mindedness to be in a room full of other people that are chasing the same thing I don’t feel like a lone wolf you know for a lot of years I was training out of a Jiu-Jitsu gym um having been the only person that was trying to do this for a living um I used to train with basil HZ who just gotten fought Jack Del D Del mandalina or whatever but uh you know that was like my only teammate and we’re kind of different in size and he was always shorter and I was tall so it was tough you know so um and that was like the only guy I had as a teammate or a sparring partner you know so uh I just was lacking a lot of things I didn’t have a strength conditioning coach I didn’t have the money for good food I didn’t have you know any type of sleep schedule or understanding or education on you know nutrition so uh just kind of winging it everything I was doing I was just winging it it’s crazy how far you got winging it with no foundation with no support yeah um and just a coach that had a full-time job two kids a fiance and working you know two jobs that I would hit pads with at 5:00 a.m. 3 days a week you know so and that’s not optimal for training you can’t be training at 5 a.m. as your main training like so yeah and then I would go to an Edge Fitness and lift like come on like you know I mean I still made it so I have I have unlimited potential and I am a very coachable person I would say that that’s that’s this that’s the other half of you know having good coaching but are you a coachable person you know um as ask coach John what it is to coach me I listen I try I do these things so um if I’m not trying then what am I doing I mean it feels like with this team around you that it’s sort of just skies the limit so talk to me about 2024 what what boxes are we checking this year well we’re getting our first Main Event I’m going to be ranked and uh got a new contract so I’m happy with that congrats on that by the way thank you uh and you know I want a new contract if you’re going to put me the top five right so um you know we’ve laid out what we want to do um you know hopefully you can never plan things by a pen and paper I don’t think but um I I don’t have super big expectations for 2024 as far as what what my plan is but uh the only plan that I have so far is Jack her Manson on February 10th and that’s my only focus and I’m going to take a little bit of time vacation that’s 2024 I need a freaking vacation do we have this vacation plan do we do we know where we’re going I don’t ever Plan before a fight that’s probably smart yeah I I I’m very like if I don’t win I don’t deserve it keep yourself hungry yeah so I know you uh you’re not looking past Jack but I have to ask because you know it’s January it’s a very exciting year and you’re fighting the number 10 ranked guy so let’s just for the sake of this interview assume that you get get past Jack her Manon do you feel like this is a year in which if you if everything works out the way that it should the way that you would like it to is this a point where you could be in title conversation by the end of the year like how how many fights do you want to have yeah so I came into the UFC and I was very vocal about wanting to take the slow route you know I wanted to do the show on a Mali Mount route where everybody’s tough in the UFC you know so you can’t sit here and say I’m handpicking or I don’t want to fight this guy right but I’m also not stupid I understand why I’m in the sport I need Financial Security I want to secure that house that car my dream I want to live live and like my life so I can love fighting more you know and uh you know fourth fight I’m already going to the top 10 and Main Eventing uh and it’s not because of Jack that’s that’s the thing that I think is super important to to recognize right it’s not because of Jack Jack’s a top 10 but it’s not because of Jack um I’m getting a good push and you know I think they like me and I’m going to do my best and my power to go out out there and do what I do best which is finish guys so um yeah I mean I would say two more fights probably a title fight or if they’re Board of the top guys kind of being stagnant throw me in there get me one more fight and then throw me in for a title fight so um if I feel like I’m ready I’ll take it but I will not take it unless I feel like I’m ready and when I say that it’s like can you handle the criticism can you handle the media can you handle um staying focused and getting through a Healthy Campus is the best you ever felt type of deal so if those things don’t line up I’ll decline um I want this to make sense and I want to hold the belt because I’m ready to hold the belt for a long time not because oh this is my only chance let me get a shot I’m not desperate I don’t sell out like that so uh I’m my best brand and I’m my best supporter and I will always have my own back so um yeah I but I don’t see why it’s not possible if if I’m just starching dudes and it’s like all right dude you just starched the number five guy number three guy number four guy you know any of those you can’t I can’t even argue with myself like why wouldn’t why wouldn’t you take that shot what do you make of middleweight right now because it’s a very different landscape than even a year ago and as we sit right here for this interview you you’ve got Shan Strickland about to uh defend his title against drus dupy huge fight for the division of course I’m sure you’ll be watching that one closely so what what do you think about the division and and the the current champ I like Sean Strickland I like that he’s coming out about you know his abusive past and you know I feel for the guy I saw him crying on one of the interviews and you know people don’t understand how it scars you for life um especially if they’ve never gone through it and uh for the and some people have gone through it and and they they think that they don’t feel any emotions right because they’ll never get emotional they never get choked up they never they’ll never talk about it and they just kind of float through life but you know I guarantee they probably have toxic relationships or they have friendships that never last or they have this toxic cycle of always messing an opportunity up or never being able to get to that next stage that they’ve always wanted to be on because these types of preconditioned or conditioned ways of living through abuse really hinder you from taking those next opportunities developing those healthy relationships healthy friendships um and even giving back you know thinking outside from yourself to be able to get back to somebody or something or you know so um I’m happy for him I think he I think he’s another testimony of somebody who we never expected to be a champion who has defied the odds become a champion over a great Champion Israel adna and um I think middleweight a stack division it’s becoming a very stacked division you know you got the guy ikram alisar off who everybody’s high on you got po nickel who I don’t think’s going to last that long um I just don’t I don’t see him being a pretty boy getting hit in the face by somebody like me or let alone anybody else that can hit you know pretty hard so um Stellar wrestling good Jiu-Jitsu is not like he’s not good at Jiu-Jitsu as well but I just I don’t see him being the fighters fight like I just he doesn’t strike it but anyway you got him you know you got Israel still in there um you got dup and Jared caner there there’s a lot of really good really good guys but they’re all beatable um they all got Hearts lungs they breathe air and uh they’ll fall just like any other man would including myself right so but I think I can make them all fall so you see a path I do yeah it doesn’t matter who I just see it I just and if I and if I don’t I won’t do this no more the immediate task is Jack Hermanson ranked number 10 and uh I saw that this was a matchup that you were really happy about why why were you happy about Jack in particular um I like Jack he’s not a talker he’s not somebody I don’t I don’t like I get like anxiety with people I don’t like because I just I obsess I’m an obsessive person when it comes to like imagining things and like I’ll re I replay the fight with Jack right whether I liked him or I didn’t I replay it every night before I go to bed I think it’s only natural maybe it’s not but for me it’s it’s all I think about every time I go to close my eyes it’s something I’m thinking about it’s I have a dream about it or I’m envisioning how it plays out good and bad and uh yeah I mean I think Jack’s a good candidate because I think he’s you know a half decent person I don’t know him I’m I’m giving him you know the the courtesy to say I think he’s a half decent person I don’t know him but uh he’s not really going to talk that much and I think his time’s up I don’t see him and when I and I said it he’s going to be upset about it right maybe if he watches it but who cares like I don’t think any of us sitting here right now would say that Jack Herman is going to be a champion or even a contender as a champion for the next 5 years nobody sees it I don’t see it he is a veteran though what’s that mean Gerald’s a veteran that means that you’ve had a lot of miles on your on your on your car you’re 10 and six you know um and every time you’ve gotten up to the top you’ve got knocked back down right so I don’t he’s a veteran but that doesn’t mean anything so am I 23 years in this game what you’ve been in a cage with people watching I don’t care I don’t I’m not bothered by people watching me you don’t see me panic and rushing and getting all crazy to try and get a finish I know if that’s all you’re leaning experience on that’s fine but you know does he have the ability to get hit and maybe survive sure but he also has the ability to get hit and curl up like he’s done with Thiago Santos and like he did with J caner against a bull uppercut that didn’t even hit him that clean so I think he’s a quitter and uh that’s what I see in him I see when our Wills are going to coll like Collide I I know that in a life and death thing who’s going to crawl further I know he’s quitting first so that’s what I believe and um I don’t think somebody that has that in them will ever hold a championship belt I said earlier that you know that edge in you comes out whenever we talk but there’s something else that I just as we’re talking now that reminds me of your belief in your power you know I’ve interviewed a lot of guys I’ve interviewed a lot of guys that hit hard and have a lot of knockouts on their record but there’s something different about when you talk about the way that you punch where does that confidence come from because I know that you know I know that you’re being pretty humble right now because I understand that you broke some records the pi is that true yeah um Hunter Campbell told me they would re release the video hopefully it comes out right but there’s a video of me breaking theanu Francis ngu the former heavyweight champions uh record um by at least 40 grand um I had I hit 170,000 and then I hit 181,000 and I did it in front of a guy named Tuco who was Brendon out when and Allen’s best friends coaches uh who was there when I was out there cornering him and I did it in front of multiple people and I broke it multiple times so it wasn’t something that was like a one-off fluke I broke it multiple times and um you know you don’t measure power by a machine necessarily transferred into a fight but I do think it’s why like Gerald mirart didn’t get knocked out and that made me angry because he just curled up um but I do I’ve always felt well even in sparring if I put little gloves on and I hit people it just they give me weird reactions and I’ve been told by many a teammates over the years man even from I was 16 years old I’ve knocked out grown men so I know I have it I know I’ve had that ability and the only way you know even when you have your first fight I didn’t know I could knock somebody out right like I believed it but I didn’t know it because I didn’t do it but I’ve always I just have that belief and it may be wrong right I might be sitting here telling this to the world it may be wrong but in my head in my heart in my mind I believe that if you put somebody in front of me I have the ability to knock them out if I catch them clean I swear on that and it might be wrong but I don’t believe it’s wrong so that’s I just don’t know what to I don’t know how to solidify that other than just that’s that’s truly how I think and that’s how I feel and but it also doesn’t mean that I can’t grapple with you and I can’t mix it up you know some guys you may never get that one punch to show that so you have to fight an MMA fight you have to kickbox and grapple so you know I’m not arrogant and thinking I’m the hardest puncher in the UFC type crap well there’s a machine that says you are so there is a machine that says that I am not happy that has not been released yet so um well we’re releasing it now so I I’m G to give it to you so there we go yeah what what kind of uh what kind of fight are you expecting from Jack um a very ugly fight I think he’s going to try and cage wrestle me I think he’s going to come out hot trying to kick me trying to you know shoot immediately I think he’s going to want to see how strong I am he’s going to want to see if he can get the Tak down um so I think we’ll get a lot of answers very quickly um and one of those is going to be I think the fight kind of goes one of two ways right I can’t get them off of me and it becomes his style of fight where he’s able to dictate where we’re going and uh I’ll do some desperate right like I’m not going to sit there fight 25 minutes getting wrestled I’ll do something I’d rather get submitted than than lose 25 minutes getting dominated so I’m going to go I’m going to find a way to go for it um or he can’t get the taked down like he thinks and now he has to fight me where I want to fight um I think it’s so secret where we want this fight to be he’s predominantly a Grappler I’m predominantly what everybody thinks is a striker and uh yeah so that’s that’s what people don’t know they don’t know how this fight’s going to go they think he’s going to shoot they think I’m going to strike so we’ll see um but I can tell you that when I do touch him I will damage him and that is going to change the trajectory of this fight and the pace of this fight um he comes out real heartening real real hard and like comes crazy and then crashes pretty good so um there’s a lot of holes on this man so I’m going to try and plug in those places that are that are gaps that I think are gaps right this is all speculation but uh you know we’re doing a good job preparing what we think uh are openings when you’re laying there in bed and thinking about this fight and thinking about how you’re going to get that finished what uh what are you what are you envisioning so I’m not going to say what I think I hit him with but I think I break something on him I think I break something in his face I think I break something on him that’s that’s literally what I Envision I always say it like I think I think he he overcommits way too much and uh I think those are where I find my best shots and I can fight going forward and I can like going backwards so um yeah I think I I think I break something on him I think I shock him I think he I think he gets hit with something and he doesn’t know what hit him it’s been a long long road to get to this spot and you’ve had to overcome a lot I mean the injuries not just in fighting though but your entire life you’ve overcome so much what does it say about you that you’re here today and you’re about to have your your first Main Event in the UFC I don’t want to say anything’s possible Right but anything that you have a burning desire for that you have the unexplainable for that has always just kind of been lingering it’s the unspoken is what has propelled me to never give up it’s the I couldn’t put a defining answer on what it was that I was carrying but when I was standing next to somebody else I felt different when I was in high school and everybody’s talking about the girls that they were getting with I was playing chess with my my my wrestling coach when everybody would leave practice early I was the last one there when I was told I was never going to fight it’s exactly what I wanted to do and it hurt me when people would tell me that or it hurt me when I was working a regular job and people said why would you want to do this uh why would you want that name body bags that nickname what if you get knocked out it was the constant it was the constant resilience to just say you people aren’t seeing what I’m seeing so yeah I think it’s a testimony to resilience um you know being persistent being committed being disciplined and uh being relentless like I’m a Relentless person I’m like a roach you can’t kill I just keep coming back so it’s it’s pretty funny because I’ll just keep coming back I it doesn’t matter I can lose today I’m coming back tomorrow I can lose today I’m coming back tomorrow and uh yeah I always try to I always try to learn I don’t know everything I’m not the best fighter in the world I don’t have the best skills but I could be the best fighter in the world at one at one point at one point in time I will be and uh if I fall short dare to be great I don’t live by anybody else’s judgments but my own I’m My Own Worst critic there’s nothing anybody could say that could hurt me more than what I think of myself so I’m going to go out there and I’m going to give it everything I got and if I said things on this camera that were not true I took a shot that’s it well I think one day when you’re done with fighting you’ve got a great career as a motivational speaker because every time we talk it’s like it’s inspiring to hear you talk about your journey it’s inspiring to to just feel the intensity that uh that you have every time I talk to you so I appreciate this very much and I know I speak for all the fans when I say we cannot wait to watch this fight so thank you very much appreciate it Joe thank you I